JILL CORCORAN BOOKS

Greetings from Australia. A great discussion, as a...

2012-05-16T19:44:04.789-07:00

Greetings from Australia. A great discussion, as always.

A selling point could be adding 'Certified edited by a professional editor' on the cover, or even the editor's name and professional membership.

Giving away a Kindle book for short periods as part of an Amazon marketing program is called 'pulsing' and can boost ranking. ((I can tell you more when we meet at SCBWI Sydney, Jill.))

Some people give books away until they have 5 Amazon reviews, which can be important in tempting buyers.

At the London Digital Conference a couple of years ago (out of date by now?) the overall message was 'Do not undervalue your product'. It was believed that readers will happily pay 'large amounts' - up to $25 - for an ebook if they perceive sufficient added value through enhancements, eg interview with the author, background information discovered through research, the editing process detailed, an alternative ending, a bonus short story, an excerpt from the next book...

Professionally edited self-pub'd ebook by SCBWI Queensland member Karen Tyrell getting rave reviews in the first week: 'Me and Her - a memoir of madness'
http://www.amazon.com/Me-Her-Memoir-Madness-ebook/dp/B008219QQS/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top

Harassed for months by parents when teaching, she became mentally ill and Bipolar, ran to a motel and had to be discovered by police and forcibly hospitalised. The book tells the story and how she clawed her way back to health.

Very best wishes to all

Peter Taylor

After reading the post and all the comments I real...

2012-05-16T16:18:11.935-07:00

After reading the post and all the comments I realize I must be easily persuaded! I am new to serious writing (actually looking for publication) and can see valid points to each argument. Children's lit is very very difficult to break into partly I believe because so many people think they can do it but not so many do it really well. Personally, I think writers often decide to go the self-pub route because they want to "show em" after they have done good or even great work only to be turned down. After the classes are taken, the book is done, the writing partner has given it the high five, the critique group has passed it the professional paid editor has approved it and kids have howled at the hilarity it offers, it is humbling to be turned down over and over and over. I think often something wells up inside that just says "heck with this let me self-pub, put it out there and make a tiny amount just to feel better about me." Wrong? I think not...just different. Maybe the next one will be traditional. We ARE thankfully free to choose EACH TIME WE WRITE A STORY. No either/or there.

Jane's article is interesting and speaks to th...

2012-05-16T15:38:31.915-07:00

Jane's article is interesting and speaks to the level of involvement a writer desires to have (or doesn't) with the business side of things. I'm trying to weigh that out because I've run my own successful private practice for years and am very comfortable with business decisions. I'm not sure how much control (and revenue) I want to hand over to someone else if I'm doing most of the work. That said, I have yet to do any marketing for my business (I don't even have a website), as word of mouth has been so strong. This lack of marketing approach obviously isn't a viable option for selling books, so I'd have to create a new business model. Luckily, my agent has been very supportive of my thoughts about this and I don't have to make a decision right now.

Ultimately, I don't think there's a right or wrong answer, and I could see publishing through both traditional and self-publishing means. The positive is that authors now have more choices than ever, and most of us realize that we're all on the same team and are supportive of each other.

I have recently self-pubbed my first middle grade ...

2012-05-16T15:13:23.656-07:00

I have recently self-pubbed my first middle grade novel THE COLOR OF BONES in paperback and ebook formats. I've never had an agent, never been published. I searched for an agent for a couple of years with two different manuscripts. Both manuscripts received compliments about the writing, characters, story, etc., but in the end no one felt they could sell either book. I'm a realist. I get it. If the agents really felt that way, I'm glad they decided to pass.

Then, last fall, I received a 3 page set of notes about one of my manuscripts from a fabulous industry professional who pointed me in a different direction, a better, more effective, direction. I rewrote the whole book from page one, with her permission to use her notes, and then I told her I was thinking about self-pubbing. She gave me the okay and was totally behind me no matter which way I decided to go. I even had the option to resubmit to her agency. But in the end, I didn't. I published. And here's why.

I'm a teacher. I've taught fourth, fifth, sixth, seventh, and eighth grade. I've basically taught every kind of middle grade reader that ever lived. After rewriting one of my manuscripts completely, with the notes and new direction, I knew it contained various elements middle graders would like. I knew it was a true middle grade book. I knew it was the best manuscript I could write. I knew it was clean and well written and engaging and suspenseful. But I didn't do this alone. My critique group was there every step of the way. They pushed me to make the manuscript meet this high criteria. After all, I didn't have an agent's or an editor's eyes.

So now, the book has been out for one week. It's selling moderately well, with several online reviews from valid sites still to come. Middle grade is a new territory for self-pub. Distribution is tough, but I have several teachers and librarians already on my side, not to mention an army of kids. That'll count for something.

This is an industry in flux, but I would never rule out the traditional path. I'd kill to work with an editor and team of people who shared the same passion for my stories. I'd also kill to have wide distribution to school and libraries and the brick and mortar that's still standing. But in reality, I now have a book out in the world, one that I'm totally confident in, one that shows off what I can do on my own, and one that shows what I'd be capable of doing with a team of people behind me.

If only the book can find an audience amidst the rubble. We'll see.

I am planning to self-publish my sequel to my firs...

2012-05-16T14:57:46.067-07:00

I am planning to self-publish my sequel to my first book which was published by a publisher, who did nothing to promote or market my book, so I had to do my own promotion. Because not enough copies have sold, they will not consider a sequel. I am not prepared for the years of waiting in the submission/rejection cycle. I'm not getting any younger! I have had the sequel professionally edited and have a professional artist working on the cover. I will soon be ready to publish it as an e-book. I don't plan to do a print run.

Another informative perspective: When Self-Publish...

2012-05-16T10:15:56.004-07:00

Another informative perspective: When Self-Publishing Is More Useful As a Marketing Tool http://janefriedman.com/2012/05/16/self-publishing-marketing-tool/

2012-05-16T10:14:39.778-07:00

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Thank you for the post and comments. I find everyt...

2012-05-16T09:31:51.610-07:00

Thank you for the post and comments. I find everything fascinating and overwhelming at the same time.

Jill, I appreciate your comment about publishing houses still hiring. I admit that I do own an e-reader, but I still prefer a book. Even my son in college refused to go the route of e-text books, which really surprised me.

My two younger children seem to prefer books over the e-reader as well. The only advantage I have with one son is being able to hide the length of a story when I hand it to him on the e-reader. (He judges a book by how fat it is.)

I am a newbie (two years) in a writer's critique group which has met together for 15 years. Most are self published or indie published. When I think about all the work and money they put into self publishing and marketing I become overwhelmed. My thought always goes back to "When do you have time to write?"

However, I have to admit my bias up front. I would rather work to my strengths and pay someone else to do the parts that I could probably do -- after inordinate amounts of time learning how to do it.

I've been reading, and thinking, about this is...

2012-05-16T06:16:41.618-07:00

I've been reading, and thinking, about this issue a lot lately. I still can't wrap my head around the fact that a Harlequin author sold 179,000 copies of her books and made a total of only 20K. Also, I think the marketing plan for Amanda Hocking is atypical for traditionally published authors, and reflects the amount invested in her via the advance. An author with an average advance is not going to get the red carpet treatment from a publisher. They will have to do most of the work on their own, so I can see why they'd rather get 70% of the earnings rather than 8%.

As a newly agented writer, I'm struggling with this. I always thought I wanted to go the traditional route, but a lot of what I'm reading lately has me re-thinking that.

To chime in with my 2-cents in order to answer you...

2012-05-16T05:02:24.210-07:00

To chime in with my 2-cents in order to answer your question, "So I ask you all, when do you say to yourself, ah....forget publishers...."

I went that route because after sending more than 100 queries to agents/agencies, and after editing my manuscript a dozen different times, and having a dozen people pour over it with a fine-toothed comb looking for the spots I messed up. Even then, when it was as good as I could get it, all the agents (well the ones that chose to respond) said the same thing: there's something compelling here, but I don't think I can sell it.

So I said, screw it, and designed my own cover, did all the layout for the print edition, converted the text to Nook and Kindle format, made sure on my own that they displayed the way I wanted them, and made the book available for sale at the low price of $2.99.

That's why I did it. After all the work, I saw no reason to just chuck it in the trash bin considering that there's a LOT of traditionally published material out there that--in my, and other people's opinions--doesn't deserve the shelf-space they take up.

You also mention the editing and grammar being somewhat lacking in indie self-pub stuff...whereas this may be true, I have more than one supposedly professionally done ebook by big name publishers that have glaring, hideous formatting, grammar, and spelling errors. The "Big Six" aren't doing too hot on this metric, either.

Will my book find its audience? I sure hope so. Having it available for 5 months, I can count on both hands the number of sales I've made (and to date the profit to me is zero), but the fact that there are folks out there who bought, read, and liked my work enough to actually put up positive reviews on Amazon is a little bit of a boost for me...in a way, it makes me feel almost vindicated that all the agents who said "No" to me were possibly mistaken and that "my bird can fly" after all.

Do we have hopes of being the next big break-out hit? Sure! Who doesn't? But will that happen? Probably not. But I can tell you the exact same thing for all the traditionally published material. There was a lot of buzz about "The Night Circus" when it came out...since then what?

See. It's a total crap-shoot. You never know what will happen. Quoth Yoda: "Difficult to see, always in motion is the future."

I have seen this on so many blogs lately and I jus...

2012-05-15T20:36:13.840-07:00

I have seen this on so many blogs lately and I just don't see what the big deal is.

If you are concerned with reading a self-pubbed book that might not be "professionally" edited, then get the sample you can download and take it for a spin before buying. You can usually tell from 1-3 chapters if it's something you might like.

I used to be a purest. I'd only read traditionally published books. But really at .99-3.99, even if you end up not caring for the book, it's better than forking over 7.99-20.00 for a traditional you still might not like. Sure, they might have spelling and grammatical errors, but so do some traditional books that happen to slip by everyone involved. A few might have benefited from a pro editor, but maybe they couldn't afford one and really just wanted to share their story with the world. I see nothing wrong with this. I also think that not everyone knows or cares when there are mistakes. The majority of people out there aren't with the grammar police. Most just want an entertaining read.

I think of it like pizza. There is a place about an hour away from me and the pizza is consistently amazing. But the money (and time) getting there is only for special occasions. So I eat the local pie, which isn't nearly as good, but still satisfying and easily accessible.

I also think that some self-published writers have had bad experiences with agents and/or publishing houses. Others go all in for self-pubbing without trying the traditional route because they like that they have full control. Whereas some want nothing to do with the editing, design and marketing and just want to write and hope that they can be picked up by an agent. And I think a lot of the stories you hear about people trying to sell their book traditionally is discouraging. Going to workshops, conferences, critique groups, having an agent ask for more then turn you down, having an agent pick you up and then never being sold, being sold to a Big 6 and be put through 20 rounds of revisions that basically makes you rework your entire story, having your editor leave the company and being shelved because no one else wants it, being put in a low tier for a minimum print run, not having the full backing of marketing and understanding your original vision, being dropped because your sales were low. It's one thing to fail on your own doing, but to not even be given the chance is heartbreaking after all that work.

You also hear a lot of traditionally published authors saying how it's rare to make a living writing and even they have other jobs or they wouldn't recommend it as a career. The majority of traditionally pubbed writers aren't best selling and even those that are, aren't necessarily making a full time living at it. You'd be lucky to sell more than your advance especially if they (the publishers) decided to print a certain amount and most debut authors don't get a large number of printing to even hit a best sellers list. And if you are lucky to get past your advance (and returns) and can start making royalty on your sales that number is so low by the time you receive your check (isn't it like only a few times a year) it's usually not enough to survive. And what happens if you don't sell a lot because either your book wasn't marketed well or wasn't giving a good print run or just got bad reception? Then you're dropped. I can see why after all that, which is YEARS, can throw aspiring writers in the direction of self-publishing, especially when Amazon and the like make it so easy. And you know what? That's okay. Because this is America and we grow and thrive on freedom and being able to choose what is best for us personally. It sure is better than someone telling us what we can and cannot do, or read!

Sorry this was so long, just wanted to get my point across as a reader and writer.

I find it interesting that a lot of self-pub autho...

2012-05-15T18:15:41.847-07:00

I find it interesting that a lot of self-pub authors went that route after they couldn't get an agent.

Well said Greg.

2012-05-15T17:19:14.258-07:00

Well said Greg.

First off, to Kelley - tons of books that are exce...

2012-05-15T15:59:16.824-07:00

First off, to Kelley - tons of books that are excellent don't sell well from traditional publishers, so there is simply no way to know what would've happened to your friend had it gone a different way - could've been edited differently, had a different cover, etc, and everything changes. All we know is that it's different.

Jill - I agree about the blurring of lines and the bizarreness of paying for reviews from the Kirkuses of the world. And there is no question that the ease of entry into self-pubbing means that lots of lower quality work gets out there. We agree. That said, there is quality self-pub out there if you believe reviews - lots of mysteries, genre, romance, erotica, and beyond. Are there tons of well-edited children's books? Not as many, but it's a newer, smaller niche right now. There will be, however. And, frankly, I'll put my own poetry collection up against others any day. There are many people who DO take craft seriously.

What I don't understand is the black/white lines that are being drawn. Self-pubbing doesn't mean turning your back on traditional publishing. They are not mutually exclusive; they are choices. One is not inherently bad or good. As we progress more in this field, curation will exist - and frankly, I don't think it matters if something is pubbed by a big company or not, as long as it is quality.

Oh, and to add to the reasons - since most people can't make a living from their books alone in children's publishing, and since agents and editors often take months (or in some cases, years!) to respond to queries and manuscripts (or, in some cases, refuse to take them), there is something to be said for the ability to have a book to market on your own terms, in your own time. Oh, right... there's the whole royalty on e-book issue, too.

Again, though, my thought is that these don't have to be battles. Publishers can bring a lot to the table, and that has value. Each person makes a choice about what that value is for them. That's how it should be, isn't it?

Publishers are picky. Agents are also picky. But t...

2012-05-15T14:23:02.537-07:00

Publishers are picky. Agents are also picky. But that doesn't mean a book can't do well.

I have a good friend who self-pubbed a book recently, and despite it not being professionally edited and not doing any marketing, by word-of-mouth alone she's done EXTREMELY well. Far better than either of us thought she would. I can only imagine if she'd managed to place the book in a traditional publishing house and had the marketing to back it up.

I have one book through a traditional publisher and another forthcoming, but I'm putting serious thought into self-pubbing the book after that, just to see how it goes. But who knows. ;)

I had a point to this and I forgot what it was. Probably something about how self-pubbing seems great for some people, but *really* not for others? I'd still love to snag an agent and go that route one of these days.

Would you be open to a picture book submission at ...

2012-05-10T10:48:17.188-07:00

Would you be open to a picture book submission at this time?

How should we show chapter breaks? The old way lea...

2012-05-07T12:43:50.505-07:00

How should we show chapter breaks? The old way leaves too much space between them. Thanks! I don't have an e-reader either, so this is great information.

Paranormal, are you over that? If not currently po...

2012-05-01T18:59:59.482-07:00

Paranormal, are you over that? If not currently polishing a paranormal romance mashed with Greek Myth protagonist is a biracial female.

Halli, that is the perfect time to look for an age...

2012-04-30T21:43:03.937-07:00

Halli, that is the perfect time to look for an agent since you are in the catbird seat. Only sub to agents you really want to work with and that love your writing, not just the easy sale you are handing them.

Yes I am, but it has to be guy authentic!

2012-04-30T21:40:36.583-07:00

Yes I am, but it has to be guy authentic!

Question: if I have a novel already contracted wit...

2012-04-30T13:49:46.599-07:00

Question: if I have a novel already contracted with a publisher, but the sequel is not, would an agent still represent the sequel, knowing the publisher will most likely pick it up? Is it smart to still hunt for an agent even after I already have a signed contract (for book 1) without one?

Are you accepting queries for manuscripts written ...

2012-04-30T10:09:22.656-07:00

Are you accepting queries for manuscripts written from male POVs? I know you mentioned before you were interested in female POV. (If teen boys are realistic - no special powers or anything, just emotions.)

Are you accepting queries for manuscripts with mal...

2012-04-30T09:58:13.832-07:00

Are you accepting queries for manuscripts with male POVs? I know you have mentioned before that you would prefer female POV. (One with real teen boys - no special powers or anything, just emotions.)

That was a great read! Your input is encouraging t...

2012-04-30T08:04:48.350-07:00

That was a great read! Your input is encouraging to say the least and one day I hope to have a great agent not unlike yourself!

Marthas rock! Congratulations.

2012-04-24T08:17:35.136-07:00

Marthas rock! Congratulations.